Posted by: thescoundrel | January 11, 2008

Ron Paul Campaign Effectively Over After South Carolina Debate


Ron Paul let his nips slip in the South Carolina Republican debates. As did his the militant section of his followers, following the debate, by attempting to skew the text messaging polls and later the Fox News debate blog. Paul even admitted in the debate that many of his followers are hurting his campaign with their actions. I find some of Paul’s ideas interesting. But once he starts speaking he often transforms into the mad prophet Howard Beale, 😈 sticking his head out of office buildings, flailing his arms around and screaming I am as mad as hell and I am not going to take it anymore!!! During one of his Mad Prophet moments in the South Carolina debate he began to ramble about the recent Iranian speed boat incident and the moderator had to intercede. After he was stopped and reminded about the confusion of his answer, he was clearly embarrassed. It was absolutely the worst debate performance I have ever witnessed. With his poor South Carolina performance, it is very well possible that Ron Paul drove a knife through the heart of what little chance that he and his followers imagined that he had left of winning the Republican POTUS nomination. I think the Frank Luntz focus groups are tiresome and are non-enlightening at best. But I totally agree with their Thursday night assumption that Ron Paul stunk up the debate in SC. Almost immediately the militant factions of his campaign displayed their blinded focus by trying to distort the debate results, failing to realize that this was only creating even more antipathy towards their candidate. They seem to be the same factions that spam the blogosphere when someone tries to discern and discuss the Ron Paul movement. In many ways they are destroying Ron Paul’s campaign even more than Paul’s own Mad Prophet moments. I don’t know, maybe that is the true aspirations of that small part of the Ron Paul movement?

Debate Transcript Link 

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Responses

  1. Ron Paul stank up the debate? We report, you decide:

    McCain: “All they’ve got is burkas and one-way tickets.”

    Thompson: “We’ll send them to their virgins.”

    Huckabee: “We’ll show them the gates of hell.”

  2. What finished me on Ron Paul (I wasn’t exactly a staunch supporter to begin with) was his appearance on MTP, when he claimed the US Civil War could have been avoided—as if there hadn’t been about a century’s worth of advoidance as it was!

    Paul says the federal government should have just BOUGHT the slaves from the slaveholders, and war, along with 600,000+ dead, would have been avoided.

    This is just beyond stupid. I insist that any POTUS I vote for have at least a rudimentary grasp of history.

    Sheesh!

  3. What the hell debate were you watching? Ron Paul had one of his BEST performances in the debates this season. Oh, and that part about the Brit Hume interruption; there was no confusion. After each candidate pushed the buttons of power with the “gates of Hell” and the “send them to their virgins” sentiment, Paul was quick to calm the seas. Mr. Hume apparently wasn’t paying attention when he tried to tell Paul that the other candidates’ comment were passive. Does “gates of Hell” sound passive to you?
    Of course you and many other folks out there are too bent on underminding Paul to see this.

  4. Since I did not see the debate I only have second-hand accounting of it BUT from what I understood from most sources (not all ron paul supporters) the whole debate was stinky for the most part.

    Seems to me that maybe they all have difficulties. Don’t look too closely at any of them if you’re looking for perfection. Also, very few of us were around at the time of the civil war so who’s to say for sure about that? The main point is who can take our country in another direction and it sure won’t be the establishment candidates. They are more of the same so I’ll stick with Ron Paul. Thanks.

  5. at the time, i wondered whether brit hume and i were listening to the same debate…the other candidate’s were certainly not passive! btw–you can only vote ONCE on a cell phone, so the results were not “skewed” unless you mean frank luntz’ “random voters” questions. i thought dr. paul was brilliant! especially when he discounted the idiotic 9/11 truther question to ask if he could please participate in the current debate…he’s the only one to actually answer a question straight!

  6. Like every other hater blog out there for Ron Paul, this article is about getting traffic to the website. No one in reality thinks like this because it’s just stupid. Cause you can’t be Mr. Anonymous in public, and decent people don’t talk like this in public. LOL.

    1. There is no fact in this article.
    2. Basic journalism was ignored. What day, time, city did this happen?

    This is just someone’s angry, unprofessional opinion. Pay no attention to it. Don’t waste your time on this one. Just let this isolated soul vote. Anyone can blog people to death.

  7. Actually Liz was right, the debate was not a great one for any candidate. But that is the whole point, a candidate needs to reach the people who are not his standard supporters in the debate forum. No one candidate did anything to prove themselves worthy of taking away votes from their competition. The only candidates that got my personal positive attention were Huckabee and his Fair Tax talk and Mitt Romney with his economic spiel. Though neither candidate, in my opinion, managed to explain specifics enough to woo voters away from other allegiances. Ron Paul came across like a raving looney, to anyone who is not a Paulite, during his discussion of the Iranian fast boats. Even he was visibly embarrassed. I am not a Ron Paul detractor but I am also not a Ron Paul fanatic. I am, all for using Ron Paul to disrupt the status quo in Washington. I did not before the election process nor do I expect at this point for Ron Paul to win the Republican nomination. I have said that from the announcement of his candidacy. The world does not revolve around Ron Paul. A more likely person to successfully disrupt the status quo is Michael Bloomberg. I am not a fan of his either but I would love to see him run and shakeup Washington. I have said this numerous time; the primaries are stacked against rogue candidates like Paul to keep them from running. One of the best ways of holding them in check are the unpledged delegates in the Democrat and Republican Parties. What I did hope for was his candidacy to shake up both the Republican and Democrat parties out of their current comas that are destroying this country by playing special interest politics over the top of what is best for this country.

  8. damn, i the Paul supporters just sit around waiting for blog posts to attack.

    i don’t mean to insult your blog traffic, but none of these people seem to be regulars. i really think they must have some feed parser that looks for the words ‘Ron’ ‘Paul’ and ‘terrible candidate’ and spam every blog that comes up.

    they of course assume that anyone that doesnt love Paul as much as they do is an operative from another campaign.

  9. Jeez Scoundrel, you are shameless!

    When I want to drive up traffic, I just write a post containing the word “butt” and the porno people come a-runnin’.

  10. I thought Ron Paul performed well in the debate. I agree that he got a little off-topic in the “Iranian boat” answer though. He should have made the connection to the Gulf of Tonkin hoax and the Vietnam escalation more clear. The other Republican candidates are just pathetic. Even Hillary will be able to beat any of them.

  11. Effectively over? Are you kidding me? He got more cheers than any other candidate, especially when he fought back against the Fox News’ blatantly obvious attempts to sabotage and marginalize him. Except for one stumble, it was a knockout performance. Believe me, Ron Paul supporters were not disappointed.

  12. You must have watched a different debate. He got more cheers from the audience than any of the other candidates. Ron Paul demolished the competition, such as it was. I think he was thrown off when the moderator interrupted his answer on the Iranian incident, but, otherwise, a bravura performance for him. I wish he were as effective on stage as Huckabee, but as Dr. Paul says, this campaign isn’t about him, but about the freedom message.

  13. Forgot to add the 😀 to my last comment—I know you’d never deliberately agitate the Paulites.

  14. Yeah – well Robbie and QCEx, anyone that follows my site regularly knows I am a longtime Cub fan (who survives in a Cardinal fan family), and everyone knows that any long term Cub fan has a bit of masochism in them.

  15. This post shows a complete misunderstanding of the Ron Paul Revolution. As Dr. Paul said on one of his late night talk show appearances, he has shortcomings, but the message has no shortcomings. That’s what the Ron Paul Revolution is about: the freedom message. Smear campaigns against Ron Paul and hit pieces about him completely miss the point that it’s the message, not the man, that’s the the reason for his presidential campaign.

  16. Ladies and gentlemen, I can tell you and many of the Paulites are faithful believing followers. Unfortunately for his true believers there are also many within your movement who hurt the Paul campaign with their angry attacks on many of the blogs and media sites. I actually find some of Paul’s libertarian beliefs cross with some of my beliefs. I was actually cheering for his rant about the need to get this country of the teats of Middle Eastern oil. I was ranting myself about the same thing a few posts back when I was talking about alternative oil products like switchgrass. It is not even the only issue of which I agree with him. However my disagreements with his candidacy outweigh my agreements. My blog and personal attachment to his campaign ends at hoping he has enough oomph to bludgeon the Democrat and Republican parties back into a mood of partial sanity. Here is the skinny and sweet; Ron Paul would probably stand a better chance in a National election than he would in a Republican or Democrat primary. But the thing is he would not get the same notoriety. The primaries are designed to be controlled by party insiders. The other thing is at this point in time and history the only real chance for a successful third party run could possibly come from Bloomberg. He has the money to campaign nationwide and the political ties to woo people – Independents and voters that normally vote Republican and Democrat. Here is the other part that dooms a rogue candidate like Paul. Even if he were to manage to beat the odds and find himself elected – unless the voters cleared out the Congress of practically every sitting legislator, he would probably not politically survive his term. The presidents power is limited and Congress has been talking about attempting to further neuter the office. It is very possible a candidate like Ron Paul would actually find enough of a coalition in the legislation to override any Presidential veto. Nor are they going to be all that willing to work with Paul on his campaign issues. They do not have to. And if you think about the mania to impeach a sitting president, that has been present every since they found out with Nixon that it is very possible to run a President out of office, it is highly unlikely he would ever make it through a complete term without the good old boys running out the door. He is not liked by either party in power. He has no safety net. The best anyone can hope from his campaign is to shakeup the status quo.

  17. Um. Fox only allows one text vote per person on their poll. Someone should let Hannity and Colmes know that so they don’t look so foolish next time.

    Many people just don’t understand where Ron Paul and his supporters are coming from. They care deeply about this country and where it is headed.

    The establishment candidates in both parties are responsible for leading us here – war, empire, a collapsing currency, and economic slavery to foreign debtors. It’s not surprising that they and their followers don’t want to look at the facts.

    Paul simply talks about The Constitution and the founders intention. Too many Americans just don’t believe in America anymore.

  18. qcexaminer,

    I’m no fan of Ron Paul, but he did not say that the Civil War could have been avoided. Rather, he said that the fighting of the Civil War was not necessary to end slavery. This question has been a point of contention among American historians for decades and both sides of it have backing among legitimate scholars.

  19. Ron Paul vs. The Philosophically Bankrupt

    After reading the name-calling and other non sequiturs from the anti-Ron Paul crowd, I am of the view that their hostility arises less from his opposition to war, or the direction American foreign policy has taken for decades, or any of the other specific programs he has criticized. What troubles them the most is that Paul has a philosophically-principled integrity in what he advocates and that, to challenge him, one must be prepared to deal with him at that higher level.

    But modern political discourse long ago gave up on principles, in favor of the pursuit of power as a sufficient end. There is an intellectual bankruptcy exhibited by writers and speakers on the political “left,” “right,” or “middle.” Competing ideas and values that once engaged the minds of thoughtful men and women have given way to little more than pronouncements on behalf of narrowly-defined political programs; the validity of a proposition no longer depends upon reasoned analysis, but upon the outcome of public opinion polls.

    Ron Paul’s campaign interjects an energized, principled inquiry into the political realm, an undertaking for which men and women with no philosophic center or rigorous minds find themselves woefully ill-prepared.

  20. Actually I have talked previously of the problem with the poll text messaging numbers. They are skewed, if you look at how the numbers compare after each and every debate and the way the voting has went. I am not saying that they are falsified. I am saying that they are an abnormality to the actual primary voting base. What I am saying is that the Paul followers are more eager and much more liable to vote in a text messaging or an Internet poll than the average voter. It is not a bad thing, it is just an abnormality that skews the validity of the debate poll. The voting and other election polls continue to bear this out.

  21. Really? Ron Paul was wrong?

    http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=4009627465007108743&q=debate+south+carolina&total=886&start=0&num=10&so=1&type=search&plindex=3

    The only crazy part was how FOX news thought they were going to get away with cutting off Ron Paul’s earpiece. And yet… he was STILL right.

  22. After watching the video above, does a single person believe ANYTHING this blogger has to say? And the rest of the bloggers hatin’ on Ron Paul? Perhaps we react the way we do because these people are just childish. They don’t deserve to be responded to like adults. And their candidates? Grown men snickering and cracking jokes during a serious debate.

    Even if you agree with the other candidates in their statements above, Ron Paul was not wrong in responding the way he did.

    They also removed the part about electability, where Ron Paul handed them their asses ,from re-airings.

    Fox news was absolutely disgusting in this debate.

    Nobody should be OK with this, even if they don’t agree with Ron Paul. But, some have RPDS and can’t think clearly through their hate.

    This blogger is lying to you. Do you appreciate being lied to?

  23. Well, James, that was an interesting video. It was a very good propaganda mix. I could see how it would confuse anyone whom did not actually watch the debate. But that video was not indicative of what the candidates actually said. Anyone that actually listened to the debate questions and the candidates answers would know that each candidate started their answers by clearly stating that they agreed with the commander of the boats decision to not fire upon the fast boats. They also went on to agree that the military commander was trained to make those decisions and the decision to fire or not fire clearly was a decision that belonged to the people in the field of operation. Did the candidates close their statement with the short clips? Yes, they did. They finished their agreement that the move was the correct one to include those statements in order to say that military action should not be taken off the board of reaction and that if the commander felt threatened then the commander should be the one to make the decision on which action to be taken. Which is why the crowd was laughing at Paul when he made his rant. It is silly propaganda like that tape which makes Paul supporters so hard to accept. And if anyone is doing any lying, it is the creator of that video clip. But I figure you already know that part. I will acknowledge that it was a good job of creating misinformation but it will not help his cause to attempt to rewrite the debate. It will just shame those who try to propagate it as the actual link of events and create a darker cloud over Paul’s campaign.

  24. It all comes down to doing your research. Almost all of the candidates with the exception of Ron Paul, are CFR members or have advisors of the group. The CFR has been a globalist group with intentions of doing away with American sovereignty, borders, and constitution. If you don’t realize that; then why even bother voting?! Do you really believe everything Fox news tells you???? The media is so biased it’s beyond a joke. That’s why the smartest of us actually do our own research of facts. Ron Paul is the only candidate who has a clue. You morons voting for these globalists have no clue. Clinton was a CFR member…and he damaged the job force in this country with NAFTA. Look at what Bush has done with this country. His is also a CFR member. If he cared about American security, he would have done something about our illegals problem. It’s a ******* joke…and unless American wakes the hell up; we are all in for a big awakening. I will vote Ron Paul; don’t blame me when the **** hits the fan. Wake up sheeple!


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